Rust Belt Home Miners with BingBong_BTC and Jon

Bitcoin is close to becoming worthless.

Now, what's the Bitcoin? Bitcoin's like rat poison.

The greatest scam in history. Let's get it. Bitcoin will go to fucking zero.

Alright, you ungovernable misfits. I'm your host, Max. Everybody knows that Bitcoin is useless, worthless, and doomed to fail. But what if everyone's wrong? What if it's the system that is doomed to fail?

Join me as I speak to some of the brightest people in the space, and slither to the deepest, darkest depths of the Bitcoin rabbit hole.

Today, on "Plebmine" a month, John speaks to Bing Bong. He drove to the rural part of the Rust Belt to speak to him, and they did this interview in person. If you haven't already checked out John's incredible article, I'll link it in the show notes, and you can check it out at ungovernable misfits.com.

We have prizes and giveaways every single day of this month. And if you still want to enter with a chance to win a Plebmine hoodie, you can go to the last episode with Schnitzel and boost on fountain.

Everyone who boosts on fountain will be entered into the prize draw, and we will be releasing the winner very, very soon. Today's prize will be some seed signer bits, so that you can build your own, and I will link the tweet in the show notes so that you can enter that as well.

Remember to check out ungovernable misfits.com, and if you go to the menu, there is an entire section dedicated to Plebmine a month. Thanks for listening, and enjoy the show.

All right, Bing Bong, you ready? - Ready. - All right. First of all, I just want to thank Max and Mr. Crown for kind of lending their platform to Pleb's and Plebminers for the month of September.

Kind of really appreciate all the hard work that Max does, of course, to make the pod happen, but Mr. Crown is in the background there as well, producing a lot of the art and maintaining the website and making the awesome t-shirts and designs and stuff for that.

So definitely thanks to those guys. And thanks, Bing Bong, for inviting me to your house. - Yeah. - Here in Viral Community of the Rust Belt. - No doubt. It's good to finally meet you. - Yeah, yeah, you too.

We kind of have a similar story in the sense that we both come from working-class backgrounds, and we're working-class guys, and I think that kind of embodies a lot of the Pleb spirit is that you meet a lot of Plebminers who are also working-class.

It kind of fits in just kind of our ethos. So how did you get into Bitcoin first? - Okay, and then we'll kind of go into how you got into mining and stuff and how your story... Yeah, so first of all, thanks for having me on.

It's interesting, the whole Bitcoin space in general is like, you meet all these people, but they're from, you know, they're miles, thousands of miles away on different continents, and a lot of times you don't even get to put a face to these people, so it's really good to be able to actually sit down and be face-to-face with somebody,

but so it is cool to meet and, you know, sit out here on my deck and beautiful day, summer day. So first, I mean, the way that I got into Bitcoin, I guess for me, it was the end of 2020. I had a couple of friends that were into it.

They were kind of orange-pilling me. - Yeah. Basically, they were talking about- - People can't help themselves. - Right. I mean, once you know, I mean, it's kind of like, you just have to tell somebody.

- Yeah. - Every pleb is a Bitcoin apostle. - Right. - It's by default. - Right, so I mean, for me, it was like, okay, I started looking into this Bitcoin thing, and I think when you first get into it, it's like all the shitcoins and everything, they're like, everything looks cool.

Everything looks like you're gonna make money, and getting into it in a bull run is, you know, now I'm finding out, you know, I never really went through a bear market until now, so I'm kind of seeing that side of it, but when you first get into it, I can remember, you know, Doge pump in, and like everybody going crazy,

and Robinhood getting shut down because you couldn't, and it was just like, wow, this is crazy. So for me, you know, that was kind of my first introduction. It was like around that time frame, I'm gonna say like November, December of 2020.

I had a couple of friends that were buying Bitcoin through Swan, you know, and that's kind of the direction I went, and I kind of KYC myself, not really knowing what I was doing. I think everybody kind of goes down that path.

- Yeah, I started DCA and into Swan, and I was just, you know, mining Bitcoin, or not mining Bitcoin, but buying Bitcoin. And I got to the point with, like where everybody is, I think I was orange peeled enough to where, you know, I need, I want to buy as much Bitcoin as I can, so you talk to other plebs, what can I do?

Well, you can earn it, you can sell stuff. So, you know, actually I sold my car at- - Really? - Yeah, I mean- - You're one of them. - I'm one of them. - Yeah, I mean- - Or a lot of respect here for that.

- We were in the process of selling the car. - Okay. - I mean, that definitely made a spark. And, you know, when I was talking to my wife, it was definitely a push forward to go ahead and do it.

But we figured that we could be a one-car family. I actually have a company vehicle, so it's no big deal we really need to. So, my thought was, you know, 90% of this is going to be, I'm going to buy Bitcoin, you know?

- Yeah. - And that's kind of what I did, you know, as DCA and through Swan, and just ended up getting a pretty healthy stack. And, you know, pretty healthy for me, I guess, at the time. What I considered healthy.

- Yeah. And then, I started, you know, I'm in the space, you know, joined up Twitter. Luckily for me, I had found some of the privacy guys, and I was kind of getting into that a little bit, and I really started going down the privacy end of it, and then I realized like, you know, shit, the KYC myself on all these, on those exchanges.

- Yeah. - And what am I going to do? And, you know, there's a couple of the guys in the space. You know, I've heard a diverter say it before. I can't remember the exact quote, but basically don't let perfect be the enemy of good.

- Yeah. - So, you know, I kind of... - He puts a lot better than you did just there, but I'm sure, I'm sure, but... - So from there, I kind of just... I started down that path, and I was like, I got in with the Ronan Dojo guys.

I really liked what they were doing with the product, and I was like, I'm going to build a node, you know? And well, first I built a node, and I didn't really know what I was doing. I mean, I think that's kind of everybody in the space.

We were talking a little bit earlier before we started recording. Like, I sit back and I look at it now, and it's like, all the things that I know about Bitcoin now, in them first days, it was like, all the way, it was way over my head, you know?

And I'm trying to, it just seemed like this thing that was too big for me to understand, you know? - But you're so passionate about it that you just want to dive down every single rabbit hole and try it all.

- At the same time. - Yeah. - Yeah, that was my problem. - And I don't know if that's exactly a problem, because eventually you kind of hash it all out once you get down that rabbit hole.

- Right. - And it's like, okay, well, here's a node build. I'm going to get my Raspberry Pi, or I'm going to get my Rock Pi 64, and I have my memory, and I have my case, and I have my power supply, and now I have to pick what node implementation that I want to do, and you just start building, and like, okay, well, now I have this thing,

what am I supposed to do now? - Yeah, and actually, if I think back, you know, the first node that I built was Umbral. And, you know, I did that, and I got involved in, and then I seemed like what Ronin Dojo was doing was doing with Samurai, and running Whirlpool, and I was trying to run the Whirlpool implementation

on the Umbral, and it was always screwing up, and, you know, it didn't take me very long until I just switched that over to Ronin Dojo, and, you know, then everything started working well.

Them guys, they put a lot of hard work into that project, and I've been a fan of theirs, I think, you know, for quite a long time, actually. I just recently, you know, I bought one of the first batches of the Tanto, and, you know, it's been a good product.

So for me, it didn't take long. I was like, I went down this rabbit hole of like, oh, man, this privacy, and, like, Bitcoin's a public ledger, and that's kind of like a downfall. So how do I not, you know, I started learning about the financial system, and I started learning about what the government does to us as far as, you know,

tracking us. I read Edward Snowden's book, "Washed a Couple Duck with Documentaries," and, you know, that kind of really opened my eyes to how the world works, and to how this system works, and how they kind of have you, like, pin down almost.

So at that point, you know, when you read the white paper, and you read what Satoshi Nakamoto really wanted this to be, was a peer-to-peer cash transaction system where there's no third party, and I feel like, you know, if I'm using an exchange, or if I'm going down that route, I'm just kind of like, I'm going right back to that old site.

- You are, you're still caught in the financial system loop. - Right, but, you know, when I first got into mixing, you know, Bitcoin Q&A was a big help. I mean, his, listen to him on podcasts, and then just trying to figure stuff out, you know, I kind of went down the rabbit hole.

I went, you know, I went from running a Mac computer to switching it over to Linux, and, you know, went with the CalEx phone, and just kept going, you know, down that hole. But in the whole time, I'm still, you know, I'm still kind of DCA, and through SWON, and I'm running my stuff through Whirlpool,

and I'm sending it to a hardware wallet, and eventually, you know, you find BISC. You find HODL HODL. It was actually where I really first purchased non-KYC Bitcoin, and then I was using that for a little bit.

And then, so, you know, we're talking like April, May, June, 2021. "Econ of Welcome Miss" comes out with this guide about mine in Bitcoin at home, and I was like, well, this is interesting, and I don't even know how I stumbled on it, probably, 'cause I heard him on a podcast, you know,

so I hit him up on Telegram, and we started a relationship on Telegram, and like, just talking back and forth, and I seen some of the stuff that he was posting as far as what he was doing in his basement, in his old house, and it seemed pretty interesting to me, so I have a friend that's in this with me too,

and I was, you know, so we were best friends. We do a lot of stuff together, and so I was kind of an orange pill in him in the same way, telling him, you know, like, I think this mining thing can be profitable, I think, you know, at the time when I first got into mining, I don't, I think it was probably more about profit

more than the decentralization and maintaining the network. Now, that outlook has changed since I started mine, but I mean, I think it-- - And I think that mindset was still there when I wanted to mine is like, money signs, you know, 'cause I still didn't, I was still learning the whole Bitcoin, Bitcoin ethos and what it was all about,

and, you know, since I started mining, I mean, it's a completely different-- - It is, yeah, you're really in it. - You're right. - You're actively in it every day, you know, running a node is a, that's just one thing, you're just supplying a path for transactions, you're just supplying something to verify the network.

- Right. - But when you're mining, you're actively doing something. - Yeah. - I think for guys like us that's an important part of it. It's one thing to just buy and hold and sit back and then chat on Twitter.

- Yeah. - But I get antsy, I get anxiety, I have to be doing more, I have to be doing something. - Right. Yeah, like we always have to be doing something. And I think, you know, you talked about our backgrounds growing up, you know, I think that plays a part in it.

You know, and I mean, you can obviously see, I live out in the country, so I've been around, you know, the blood, the sweat, you know, working from a young age, I was just raised that way.

So, you know, coming up with ideas and doing that kind of stuff has always been not my forte, but I've never been scared from it. I might not know all the answers to what's going on with the electric and how we do this or how we do that.

But I've gained enough knowledge and enough people in my life that I know who to go to when I need questions answered. So, you know, and my buddy that helps me, he's like one of them guys, it's just a jack of all trades.

I mean, we can go redo a kitchen in somebody's house. We can, we're currently siding a house. We do our own day jobs. And then, you know, on the side, we're mining Bitcoin and we set it up and we're both in the process of switching over to an immersion setup.

But I guess I kind of got ahead of myself there. But back up, like when, you know, Eco came out with that guide, I was like, man, this is easy, we just need to run some electric and plug these babies in and start making money.

- It doesn't have to be any more complicated than that. - Right, right. So, you know, obviously everybody at that time, I think when the China ban happened, I mean, and that act of hash kind of just fell right off the face of the earth, mining became real profitable.

So, everybody was kind of looking at it. Well, maybe not everybody. But I think Eco and diverter really changed the game on at least, I'm not saying they were the only ones that they were doing it, but they put it out there to the public and they were able to-- - It's that spark of inspiration that they provide

and also that helping hand up. Once you start to see these guides and see the pictures and how well they put the content together, it gives people, you know, especially if you're not an electrician or you're not an IT guy or anything like that, it gives people the confidence to say that I can do this.

- Yeah, and if somebody puts together a guide, it's like, I'm smart enough to be able to read and figure it out. - How about that, right? - Yeah, I mean, I could follow instructions. My wife might say something different about that, but, you know, I feel like I'm not bad when it comes to that.

And then, you know, I can read the instructions and I could say, okay, I don't know about this, but I know that person does, so I can go to that person and say, hey, what am I gonna do to get this electricity out to my garage, because, you know, I'm at my panels all the way on the other side of my house.

So, I was able to, like, narrow that down and go to the sources where I needed. So, for me, I was like, I was telling my buddy, I'm like, we just need to buy some miners. So, we, you know, sourced them through mine farm by, great person, great person to deal with.

- Yeah, he seems like a good guy. - Yeah, I never had any issues with him. - Good meme-er. - Yes, for sure, for sure. So, for me, it was like, at that time, you know, it was more, there's always that debate.

You buy your miners with coin, or do you buy them with dash? - Yeah. - And I think it, you know, you have to look at where Bitcoin is being evaluated at. You know, where it was being evaluated at the time that I bought miners, it was, and for me, I was like, okay, I have all this, you know, KYC coin from, or I have this KYC coin.

I have it mixed. I have it sitting in my Sam or my wallet. Like, I really want to go to the non KYC side. I think I'm what, you know, I'm just going to, I'm going to use Bitcoin. - Okay. - At that time, the price was lucrative to where I could buy a miner and it was- - We probably had about 25 at that point.

You said July of last year. - Oh, this is when I bought it. So, we're in the process of going up. I can't remember exactly how much. It may have been three or four at that time, I think. It was right when the price started rising on the mine.

- Oh, I was talking about the Bitcoin price. It was about 25,000 at that time. - Yeah. - Cookbooks. - Yeah, probably. - Okay. - I'm going to say. So that, you know, and I kind of was like, okay, if I'm going to do this mining thing, and I'm going to, you know, do the non KYC thing.

I think the best thing, you know, because I've done some research, you know, okay, I can mine non KYC coins or non KYC coin. So that I think through the best for me is that if I'm going to go down this avenue or this, you know, business per se, I'm going to use the stuff that I've already gained and I'm going to purchase

the miners that way. So I actually, I use the coin to buy my miners. - And I think that's okay because you can rationalize that. You're saying, well, I'm still saying within the Bitcoin ecosystem.

- Right, right. - Yeah, so, you know, I'm using the, yeah, I mean, I used the Bitcoin to purchase the miners and I purchased two, my buddy purchased two. So we get four miners. We were, he actually, in his mom's garage, it's kind of like, it's set down away from the house, but it's still attached to the house.

But we figured, okay, we can easily mine there because everybody was like on noise mitigation was always an issue and that was always a fear, you know, when you get these is the divorce aspect of noise.

- Exactly, so I was like, there's no way that I'm going to mine at my house. There's just no way, like me and my buddy were like, okay, we figured out a plan to be able to do it there. The basement was down and all the way from the house enough that his mom wasn't ever going to hear it.

So he had a 100 amp service. So, you know, we called the electric company. We had that upgraded to a 200 amp service. - And how were they to deal with? - At that point, from going from a 100 amp service to a 200 amp, it's not a big deal because the code now around here, anyhow, I don't know if it's everywhere,

but they recommend a 200 amp service. - Mm-hmm, that's true. - So some of these older houses have 100 amps. - So they're happy to upgrade from 100 to 200. - Yeah, that was no big deal. So we took that 100 amp and we basically just ran it right off the main down to a sub-panel and we, we hooked them four miners up.

And not really knowing anything. Like I had, I had read the guide, but, you know, you're excited and you're like, man, this garage is big enough. We can just plug these puppies in and crack the garage door.

- Yeah. - So we do that and they're running and we leave. We come back the next day and, you know, there's red lights flashing on them. They're throwing codes for over, you know, ambient air temperatures too high.

And we're just like, oh, I guess we're gonna have to do something. - Now the real fun begins. - Right, now the real fun. - Now you gotta play HVAC. - Right, so the first thing we did was we, you know, we used that theory of putting 'em vertical 'cause they're what's miners and basically building the box,

using an exhaust fan to exhaust the hot air out. - Now that was another point where Equano Alchemist was helpful in your story. - Yeah. - Because he had a pretty good guide and was building something similar to that at that time, right?

- Correct, yep. And that's kind of what I did. I used his guide, we kind of piggybacked off it. It took a little bit, you know, the vapor barrier was the key 'cause when we first built it, we actually were exhausted, you know, where we didn't have that vapor barrier so we couldn't figure out the miners

who were still getting too hot and then through him, you know, he was always available on Telegram and willing to help us out. So we kind of got that all figured out, put the vapor barrier in, then it was like, okay.

Now the, we're like, all right, we got our two miners, we each have two miners and we're good. - That should be enough. - Yeah, right? - You'll never upgrade from there. - Yeah, no. Just to stop you for a second, I kind of want to describe to everybody what this setup is, okay?

You have a closet or a box with an intake down at the bottom. - Correct. - And the bottom of the intake of the ASICS themselves are down there and that is isolated from the exhaust, which is on the top by a barrier, some kind of heat block to prevent the exhaust from coming back into the intake.

- Correct. - And can you take it from there to describe, you know, how it comes out of the exhaust and outside. - Yep, so it's basically like, you know, we basically bought an attic fan that you can buy at Lowe's that pulls like, we figured out how many CFM it would have to pull to be able to exhaust them, then miners out.

- Okay. - And then basically we've mounted that to the wall. - Do you remember that number in your head? The CFM of the exhaust fan. - The CFM of his exhaust fan at the time when we bought, I think it was, I think it was 900 or 1,000.

And that works for four miners, we were good. - And that's cubic feet per minute. So sorry if you're not on the Imperial system, but you can fuck off. - Right, I agree. (laughing) - Yeah, we start talking about Celsius and stuff.

- No, I refuse to do it. - Right, I get on my phone. - But to talk to the EU guys and they're always, there were guys from South America, I'm talking about you Camillo specifically. - Right.

- I will not participate. - I hear you. - That's our American privilege. - Yeah. - It is. - So, I mean, basically, I mean, we went to Walmart and bought what I would call a Vakers Rack or, you know?

- Sure, yeah. - That's what we set them on that. Basically made that vapor barrier. I went to Lowe's, I bought two inch phone board. That's what we built the, quote unquote, hash hot out of, you know, very cheap products that you can buy at your local hardware.

- Yeah, they're all accessible. - All accessible, I think probably the most expensive part of the whole build was maybe the wire that I used to run from my main panel out to the, - It's a pretty good distance from your main panel.

- Right. - To your garage setup. - Yeah, the whole length of my house. So, and I think that's probably 48, 50. Yeah, it probably ran, it's probably a 60 or 70 foot run. - Yeah. - So you have, you have this box and it's outside and it could do that all the time, but you've done something else with it to try to mitigate your costs.

- Right. So, we'll back up to like, because we have, we're still at four miners. So I have four miners in a garage and it's getting hot. It's getting hot. Yeah, so we get it all figured out and we're like, okay, each of us have two miners.

Well, you know, that didn't take long to where we were like, okay, how many more miners can we buy? We might be able to buy one more miner and run it on his underdamp service. Or I could move my two out to my house and then he has the option to buy three more.

I have the option to buy three more. You know, so at that point, I was like, okay, I call up my electrician buddy. I was like, hey, can I borrow your amp meter? - Yeah. - So he sent, he gives me his amp meter.

I keep hearing everybody talking about the 80/20 rule. I know that I have a 200 amp service. I know that, you know, 160, 80% of 200 is 160. So you're smart. - Yeah. - Yeah. - I'm impressed.

- High school, I was, I was a genius. They learned you good around here. - Right, right. So I hooked that amp meter up. I turn every damn thing I can on in the house, the air conditioner, everything.

You know, and I'm pulling like 80 amps something. Okay, I can add another 80 amps to that. Each one of them is pulling about 15. I'm running the math in my head. Okay, I can, I can probably run five miners, you know?

So that's what we did. We ended up, we moved the hat. We left his hash out. We acquired three more miners, both of us. So same deal through Mind Farm Buy. I used up the rest of my KYC coin doing that.

That's how I purchased them. So I felt like, okay, this is an investment that's gonna pay off in the future. So that's, that's kind of how I did it. I mean, we moved them two out here. We set it up and then as we set my system up, we were in the process, you know, I mean, you can't just, it's not like Amazon, you don't order a miner

and it shows up in two days. - Yeah. - I mean, it takes a little bit of time to acquire some of them, you know? So it can be anywhere from a four to six week process. Sometimes depending on if they're coming from overseas or whether your supplier has them on stock.

So in that mean, in the meantime, we, we set my garage up. So we're talking like now we're in September, October. So we set up a hut in my garage and it didn't take me long. After we got them five miners in, it's like, okay, I'm exhausting all this heat out, right out the side of the house.

And, you know, where we live, it gets cold in the winter. I mean, it's, it's northeastern part of the world. So the United States. So we have some long cold winters. I mean, it can start.

- It is a big difference. We only live a few hours away from each other. - Right. - And when you get to this part of the area that we live in, it's significantly colder. - Yes. I mean, it'll start snowing on, we'll probably get our first snow in October, maybe first part of November and it'll still be snowing in April.

- Yeah. - When you think about it, it's, it's not steady snow that whole time. But by the first time we've seen snow in the last time, I mean, we're dealing with cold temperatures for usually six months out of the year.

- Yeah. - And then, you know, it seems like lately, like this last year went right from winter to summer. There was like no spring. - What's that climate change? - It's that climate change I've been hearing about.

- Yeah, it must be. - Yeah. - Probably is, but who knows? - I don't. - Yeah, climate change this and climate change that. We probably all need to drive electric. Climate change hit me with a wiffle ball bath.

- Yeah. Exactly. - So you, you decide that this seems silly to just blow all the stuff outside. - Yeah. And, and I had been in the space enough. I know hat, I believe, hash to heating or whatever.

He's easily, he'll easily DM you when he sees your setup on-- - He will. - On Twitter and be like, hey man, what are you doing with that? - Yeah. - He's exhausting out that, you know? So I mean, he was, you know, just chatting with him a little bit.

- He's very encouraging to everybody to have that. - For sure. And, and you know, just talking to, just seeing what other people were doing in the space. I mean, you can learn everything off Bitcoin, Twitter.

I mean, I don't even think you need to go to school anymore. You just get into account-- - Bitcoin, Twitter all day. - Right. Anything you need to know. And if you're in, then like, telegrams like a graduate degree.

- Right. Yeah. That's like your higher education. - That's called, telegram is higher, pleb higher education. - Right. - Yeah. So it didn't take long. And I was like, well, you know, I can at least, maybe, you know, I, what we did.

So what, what actually, when we did this, I put the exhaust fan on a, on a switch. So I could turn the fan down. 'Cause I thought, when we first put this in, I thought, man, when it gets winter, if I can cool these babies, I probably won't be able to run that.

I probably wouldn't, and I'm thinking power savings. Like, I could probably just, I can turn the fan down a little bit. - Drop in the bucket. - Save a half an amp, you know. But that was kind of the thought process.

When we first put it in, it was never to actually use the heat elsewhere. But so I put a dial switch on it. So I could turn it to up or down. 'Cause I, I used the third, I think my fan, when we put it in was 1350 CFM.

So I was like, well, I probably won't need all that. So I would be able to turn it down. I didn't know how much noise it was gonna make. So I thought, well, if we could turn it down, it might mitigate the noise.

So we set the whole thing up. And, you know, so back to the noise mitigation part of it. Like, I think that everybody kind of gets scared of that. And everybody is like, oh man, these things are, you know, if you have a minor, it is running eight or 9,000 RPMs on their fan.

You're gonna have, you're gonna have some issues. But, you know, we're talking winter. You can get them down 29, 3000 on the What's Miners. Even right now, you know, I mean, you were, you were in my garage a little bit ago, and me and you sat at the back of my truck and had-- - Not, not offensive at all.

And it's, you know, 70 degrees outside right now. - I mean, at first, you know, my wife was like, what, you know, I can hear 'em, I can hear 'em. You know, you sit in the living room 'cause they're on the adjacent wall to my garage.

You shut the TV, y'all are sitting there, you can hear 'em hum. Well, that, you know, that lasts about a month through the nagging of like, hey, these are loud. I can hear 'em. The sudden it's like, you don't even know they're on it.

- Just like your desensitized to her nagging, she's desensitized to the sound of the miners. - Right, right, now we live in perfect harmony. (laughing) So, you know, it didn't take long. So I was like, okay, we got cold winters.

What can I do? Well, I can at least, maybe I can just shut that fan off and open the door on the, on the hash hut and just let that exotic, well, you can do that, but you can't really control the heat.

- Yeah. - 'Cause you're just blowing all that, all that heat is heating your garage. So, you know, I go on the Amazon, I start looking at these infinity fans. You know, I buy a six inch one and I just, I basically, bands I make the thing out of foam, I can just cut a hole in the top.

I cut a hole in the top and I buy some cheap six inch insulated duck work. And I, and them infinity fans have like eight speeds on 'em. So I just run a duck work and point it out, put a 90 on the end of it and point it out so I can control the heat.

So now I can shut my gas furnace off in my garage for all winter. And, you know, that was cool, you know, my, and now all of a sudden I used to keep, you know, the garage 55, 56 in the winter time.

Now 60, 65, no big deal. - Whereas in the winter time, you don't feel like being a 50 degree to garage. So you might not change your oil at that time. You might not do a lot of work in the garage that you can now achieve, it's warm enough.

- Yeah, and I mean, I ride bicycles. So I do like, I work out in the garage during the winter. So sometimes you don't want to be working out when it's 50 to 55 degrees. Now it's a comfortable temperature.

So that was a plus. And then, you know, the more I got thinking, I'm like, I could probably, my basement's always kind of chilly. And when I read it, I have baseboard upstairs in my house, but when I redid the basement, I just put beans that it's underground.

It usually keeps pretty warm, a steady temperature. So it's usually cool in the summer. And then that coolness always kind of hovers there in the winter time. So it can be like 64, 65 down there, even in the winter time.

And that's a little chilly. So I had some baseboard, electric baseboard that I used to use. And I thought, I don't want to use these anymore. I mean, they drive up the cost of your electric and my electric bill was already enough with the miners.

So I thought, you know, how can I, how can I get this heat through the my garage wall to be able to heat the basement up? 'Cause, you know, obviously heat rises. So I'm thinking, well, if I can heat the basement, at least get some of this air into the basement.

It's going to help throughout the whole house. So my air conditioner system, being that I have baseboard, it has to have its own duct work because it's not a forced air system. So I had, I was an afterthought when I put my AC unit in.

So it's in my basement. And the duct work runs through the basement and then up into the ceiling in my first level there. So for me, it was okay. I have these dump zones that I would use off of the AC system in my basement.

So if I needed to, I could open them up and blow air down to the basement. But the problem is that my, you can see, we're sitting in my yard, I have no trees. So in the summertime, basically the sun hits the house the whole time.

So at that point, it was like, okay, I never used the ducts for the AC. So I'm like, I don't need them. I can just get rid of them. I don't need them in the summertime. - It's expendable.

- Right? So I yanked them puppies out. I closed them off and then I took the duct work. I took the diffuser fans and I just, I come through the, I put a hole through the wall of my garage and I ran that, that insulated duck into there and piped it into the house.

And I have that, what I did is I got another six inch infinity fan with eight speeds on it. And then I can just, I can adjust that. So through that, I started heating the basement and then I noticed a dramatic cost of like, my gas went down because, I mean, we're not, it's not kicking on and off all the time.

- Yeah. - 'Cause, I mean, I'm being sufficient with the heat. I mean, you figure, you know, when we first started mine we were paying, you know, 10 cents a kilowatt hours or so. - Yeah. - So it wasn't, you know, when you're paying $1,400, $1,500 a month for electricity, you don't wanna just blow that.

I mean-- - You have a resource here. - Right. - It's like letting fruit rot on the vine if you don't capture that waste heat. - Right. And that plays right over to immersion too. So then, you know, like I talked about us going into the immersion side of things.

So the more I'm looking into this and more I'm like, okay, like, so now it's about how do we preserve the miners? Like I have this investment. I hear all about this immersion. We put them in oil and the cool part about it is is I can run them more efficiently because we can take the fans off of them.

They can last longer from what everybody's telling me and what makes sense in my head. And then also, I'm really not sacrificing the heat that I'm using now because that gas resonator heater in my garage will just be moved to the other side.

And when I make-- - Now that, that, that, that resonator heater, that gas goes to that. - Yeah. - So now you're using natural gas. - Right. - Now you're already using natural gas for your, for your boiler, right, right.

But that takes its own natural gas source. And it's not quite as efficient as boiling water is. That's just straight up the teeth, these coils. And then let's blow the heat off of those coils.

- Correct. - I want to backtrack a little bit to the infinity fans. Can you describe what those are to people in case they don't know what they are? - Yeah. So an infinity fan, I think, when you look them up on Amazon, I think people use them in like a growing atmosphere.

- Yeah. - Move air. - The move heat. - A lot of similarities between grow rooms and the miners. - Right, right. Yeah, we use a lot of electricity. We use the same type of fans. So, yeah. So basically, I mean, if you, if you do a quick search on Amazon, you can easily find them.

They're, they're called an infinity fan. They, I think they want, I think they pull three or 350 CFM. It all depends because you can get a six inch one and eight inch one. I mean, I've seen just recently on, on Twitter, people are using them to actually cool their machines and keep them quiet.

- Yeah. - Because you take off the fans and put the infinity fan on the back with a pair of-- - Yeah, they take crypto clothes pants, right? - Yeah. - Throw them on there. - Yeah, so I mean, if you're interested and you don't have the infrastructure, like maybe me or you do, we both kind of, I mean, even you're, you're mining

a little bit different than I am. I mean, I'm mining out of the garage. You kind of have yours throughout the house. They're doing the same thing that I'm doing. So in that aspect, say you don't have the infrastructure to put something like this up.

I mean, I've seen that picture on Twitter. I mean, we're talking the length of the miner plus that infinity fan. You're talking, it's in a space that's maybe two or three feet, you know? - Yeah.

- And he said he was getting pretty good decibels out of that, the miner, so. - Yeah, I think Austin Barnhill just did a build of those. And they're pretty easy. - Yeah. - Yeah, so them infinity fans are cheap.

I think they're less than a hundred bucks or something. - Vivo Sun also makes an inline fan like that. - Okay. - And I think the ones that I have are eight inch and they're maybe like 650 CFM.

- Okay. - Okay. Yeah, they may be a little bit higher. I might be off on that rating. But the eight speeds on them is great. I mean, if you really wanna go down, I mean, you can actually buy temperature sensors for them and actually control them that way.

And they'll actually adjust depending on what temperature. So, but for me, that made speeds. I mean, if I want a little more heat in the garage or the best part about the whole setup is because I put that switch on the exhaust fan in the garage wall.

So in the winter time, when it gets cold, if I'm trying to pull heat from the hash hut and it's blown it all out the wall, it's kind of hard to get. - It's hard to pull back from that. - Right, the problem is that's drawn more than the two infinity fans.

So the fact that I can just take that dial switch and turn it down to maybe a quarter. Now all of a sudden I'm getting better heat coming out of the infinity fans pulling out. So it works pretty well.

But, and then going back to the immersion thing. So I can basically do the same thing with immersion. You know, like I said, move that resner heater over use basically the same theory. I'm just going to use the coolant that I'm.

- Now you've been air cooling. - Yeah. - For less than a year. - You're already into an immersion build. - Yeah. - Yeah, totally. - Does that seem manic to you? - Yeah, a little bit. - Yeah.

- The best part about it is I can get my buddy right on board because. - Yeah. - And he's the one, you know, I mean, I'm the guy, I'm the resource guy. So he, I'm the guy that's in the, you know, I'm the guy that's in the Twitter, they're telegram and on Twitter and I'm like, sending them stuff and I'm reaching out

and I'll ask what he'll be like, I need to, I need to answer to this question. So I'll be like, you know. - I know where to go. - I know where to go. - I think one of the craziest things and kind of I deal with the same thing too.

I'm doing the build, just copying off coin heated, getting a tank from coin heated and, and a pro energy and just doing exactly what they do. That's, that's more along. - Yeah, my, my kind of style is just copy off them.

And I think to myself, aren't I crazy? I mean, this, this is killing my ROI for everything that I've built before. I was in a good space to make my money back, make my Bitcoin back on the machines and build more Bitcoin for the future.

And hopefully as things progress, the price of miners goes up. I sell them, I wait for a little bit for them to go back down. I get more and kind of go through this cycle the same way an institutional miner would do.

But we don't, we don't operate that way. It's part of that mania, part of that anxiety that have to be constantly doing something. And I think it will pay off in the end. Not quite sure how and I haven't worked the numbers out.

And I think a lot of the DCA guys don't quite understand that. Well, don't you realize that if you had just bought Bitcoin at that price for the price that you got these machines and your cost to the, the, the electricity and everything.

And I understand that you're saving some money by heating your house, but the numbers don't seem to match up. And I think the part that they don't understand is there's something, there's something more inside of us when we want to do the home mining thing.

There's an obsession. - Yeah. And I think, you know, like I talked about in the beginning, it was more, oh man, I'm going to make money on this. You know, I'm going to ROI all my stuff. And now it's to the point where it's like, I've gotten to the point in Bitcoin where like, I believe, I understand what Satoshi Nakamoto

was trying his envision. I mean, I may not, I may not see his envision, his vision to the point of what he's seen it as, but I, I can ride his coattails and be like, I understand that and it makes sense to me, especially when you look at what's going on around in the world today, it's just like, it's, it's crazy.

The financial system, like everybody always says to me, I just don't understand Bitcoin, you can't hold it. I said, what, you know, you swipe your card. How many people carry cash anymore?

It's like, I was just, I was just the other day. I got an email because I was supposed to go to a concert and I didn't go, but it was at PNC Park. PNC Park is, you cannot use cash there. It is a cashless park.

Yeah. I thought, man, that's interesting. And that's the, that's the direction that I feel the government or, you know, where we're at today. That's the direction they want us to go. They want that CBDC.

They want that. - So do you think the adoption of CBDCs by governments will actually help with Bitcoin adoption? - I hope, and I think it can help with Bitcoin adoption in a way that it can change people's opinion about not holding something physical.

- Yeah. - And that there is a digital wallet. But then of course, then that means now we're competing directly with the powers that be. - Right. - And that'll kind of push us to the, they find us stage.

- Yeah. I guess for me, it's like, when I think about, okay, you have, you have us home, the pleb home miners, and we're trying to make the, we're trying to really decentralize the network because when I think about, you know, people like the big mining companies, like the ones that, you know, okay, what happens when push comes to shove?

They're publicly traded mining companies. When the government comes knocking on the door, like, you know, the people that have talked about this, like, you know, they're gonna, you know, they are gonna fold, I think.

- They will. - You know? - And they will bend the knee. They've already bent the knee quite a bit to build what they have. - Right. - There was huge regulatory hurdles that they had to go through in order to construct the mining operation that they have.

- Right. - It's just another regulation that they have to capitulate to. - Yeah. And, you know, the- - There's no fight in them at all. - No. And I guess the, you know, the blockchain being a public ledger and then, you know, once your KYC yourself, I mean, the chain analysis of that is just like,

I mean, you're basically an open book to anybody that wants to coin base or swan or anybody that really wants the, you know, like, I was listening to, you know, Max's podcast the other day with Dragon and they were talking about like, you know, he was in the trading game.

And, you know, you look at these companies and like, he hit $5,000 worth of trading and that company didn't have to send that money to the, to the basically the IRS, but they sent the information right over to them.

It's like, they're more than happy. - Right. They're capitulating and they're not even being pressured or being put in their thumb on, you know? So it's like, what's gonna happen when push comes to shove?

- So in the mining ethos or in my mind, it's like, okay, I get to be a part of this decentralization. I get to say, you know, I don't want to ever want that 51% attack to happen. I don't ever want Bitcoin to be changed because, you know, some mining company feels like they want something to go different.

- Yeah. - I mean, when you really look at, and it's crazy, when you, you know, we were talking about, you know, sliding the card and you can't hold it. But when I asked them, when I asked them people, I said, do you think in our lifetime the financial system is gonna, you know, our dollar is gonna crash?

Yes. Okay. Then maybe you should look into Bitcoin because this is a way to obfuscate that system that's broken. - I'll just wait till it collapses. - Yeah. - And then I will be directed in whatever direction that the powers that be want me to be directed in.

- Correct. - I won't think ahead. - Yeah. - Why would I do something like that? - Yeah. I mean, it just totally amazes me. The more you sit here and you, you, I mean, these people try to sell you on the fact of an inflation reduction bill.

(laughs) - They're gonna print more money. - Yeah. - But they're gonna lower the inflation. - Yeah. - And for some reason they want us to buy that. I mean, I don't, I don't, like you said, I'm pretty good at math, you know?

I mean, I went through high school. I mean, it doesn't take a rocket science like to figure out like that doesn't make sense to me. Like turn on the money printers and somehow we're gonna lower the inflation.

- Yeah. - You know, we can't just, so would the thing that people don't understand about Bitcoin is that they don't understand the scarcity aspect of it, the way that she said that, that's a hard, that's something hard to hammer into people.

- Right. - They don't you understand the scarcity? - Yeah. - Is one of the biggest advantages of this. - Yeah. And it, you know, so you start talking about it. Okay, there's 21 million. We've already mined over 19 million.

When's the last coin gonna be mined? Some were 21 for you. I don't get that. That doesn't make sense to me. So I mean, it is scary. - It is scary. This is true. - It's like a brown in your pocket.

- Exactly. Like we talk about it in the plug miner telegram group. Like how do you, how do you orange pill somebody that's never, you can't save them all? - Yeah. - And you're not going to.

You can kind of take almost any moral ethos and try to push it upon people. And they're not gonna get it. - Yeah. I mean, the one thing nice about when I got into space, I did dabble in shit coins.

I'm not gonna lie. But like I had people that have been in Bitcoin to the point where they're like, but you know, I lost my ass in Bitcoin only. So I had them people that were like, don't do the shit coin.

- You should have like a, you know, maximalist clubs rowing around in a lifeboat. - Right. Yeah, exactly. That's what we need. So, you know, I had to, I had a couple of people that were plugging that in my head, like don't go down this route, you know?

So for me, but, and then this just might be me, but like when it, so going back to like, okay, now I'm mining Bitcoin, before I was, you know, I was buying it off an exchange or buying it from Swan.

I mean, I don't know if you technically call it an exchange, Swan and exchange, but I guess probably so. - I think Barnminer has some things to say about. - Yeah, he really likes that. - Yeah, that's what I heard.

- Prime trust, it's like one of, you know, in his top 10 for sure. - Big fan. - Yeah. And Barnminer's great. It's awesome to be able to watch what he's doing down in Florida. - Yeah. - Can't wait to meet up with that pleb one day.

But, so, you know, it's like, we see everything that's going on and I'm like, okay. So I'm mixing this stuff through Whirlpool and you know, you get into that thing like, okay, now I'm buying it off a bisque and I'm buying it off a hodl-hodl and you're running it through a mixer and it's like, okay, but you can't,

you end up, you have to learn about all this stuff 'cause you got this Docsick change and you don't wanna, basically you can run some Docsick change through a mixer and mix the coins together.

And then all of a sudden you kinda docked yourself on where that coin came from. So, I feel like now I have the perfect setup because I'm to the point now where like, I mine through a pool and you know, I get it that not everybody has this ability but I mine through a pool.

I get that coin and then I can mix that coin and I can send it right to my multi-sick wallet and I can do that without ever having to worry about doxing anything because I'm mining it all from that pool, you know what I mean?

So I'm not, when you know, when you're doing it the other way you have to keep good labels in your wallet to know where that stuff comes from and it can be very overwhelming to somebody that's new.

You know, it took me a, I guess, a couple, a year, year and a half to figure out like okay, it's like I always tell my wife like if we have to shut the miners off you gotta turn the money printers back on, you know, 'cause that's the joke, the other money printers.

But it is cool because now it's like I feel decentralized. I feel like okay, I mine in that coin. I get that coin to deposit it to my wallet. I mix that on my tanto or through sparrow wallet, I send it to my multi-sick wallet and it's like, you know, what, and I'm in control of that

and I run it through my own node and I'm private about it so nobody could see my transactions on somebody else's node or anything like that or server. So do you think you would be where you are in mining without first being a privacy pleb?

Did that help you in your journey? I think it helped me in my journey because I think I started, I definitely started going down the privacy road before and that's how I got into diverter and Colonel Alchemist and then started talking to the Ronan Dojo team and getting involved with them.

I mean, Brother Rabbit has been, you know, and that was cool. I had the chance to go to Bear Arms and Bitcoin this year in Miami and it's cool because, you know, like we started out the podcast, we were talking about, you know, being thousands of miles, hundreds of miles, different continents, well, you know, you come together

and you actually get to meet some people, you know, especially I got to, you know, and I learned a lot of stuff. Like I learned that multi-sick at that conference. I learned that multi-sick isn't scary.

I learned that, you know, seed signer is a great tool to be able to set up a multi-sick. I learned that, you know, the seed, the mint plates are perfect to be able to stamp your QR code in and then put them in different spaces so you're not obfuscating everything in one location.

I got to meet a Colonel Alchemist. I got to meet the diverter. I got to meet Craig Sparrow. You heard Craig Raw, the guy behind the Sparrow wallet. I got to meet the samurai team. I mean, these are all people that like, I kind of look up to in the space because like they helped me in my journey.

Like that's a high, their arms of Bitcoin is a high value, high signal place to go and talk and meet with plebs. For sure. And so that's kind of the one thing that we're trying to do with pleb minor month is not everybody's able to fly to Miami or to fly to Austin for some of these conferences.

But maybe we can kind of communicate with each other and build those relationships in this format, you know, like me coming up here to your house and seeing your mining set up and kind of get to touch and feel the things that you're doing.

I've already learned a lot from you just from this visit. And so hopefully we can kind of, some of this can trickle down to other people. - Yeah. - And they can start to learn and connect in that same way.

I'm hoping, you know, the future of pleb minor month that we do this again, not in the summer, but in the winter time. - Yeah. - Just cause it's a lot easier and it's easier for us to talk about the recycling, the heat and stuff like that.

- Correct. - That we'll have a similar value to things like bare arms and Bitcoin. - Yeah. - Now, would you have rather gone to bare arms of Bitcoin or the Bitcoin conference? - Oh, I had the option.

- Right. - It's definitely bare arms and Bitcoin. - No doubt, 'cause you get to connect with people. - Right. - I don't, you know, like when I look at, when I, you know, the Bitcoin conference is cool and everything, but it's like, like I said, when you look at, you know, the public blockchain and you want to be private about it,

it's just, you know, there's people out there that understand how to do it. I mean, to me, like the whole world pool idea and samurai guys being, their devs being able to come up with that stuff, it's just like mind-blowing.

Like, to me at the beginning, it was mind-blowing. I mean, now that I know a little bit more about it, it's nothing I would have ever came up with, but it's cool the technology is like- - As long as you can grasp it.

- Yes. And you always have that resource because so many of those guys are always available on Telegram. - Right. - As I wonder, when does Bitcoin Q&A sleep? - Yes. - And Brother Rabbit, he's in all the Telegram groups.

- God bless him. - Yeah. - Yeah, and I got to meet him. I mean, he was at Bear Arms in Bitcoin, you know, so it's like, not only do I get to meet somebody, you know, some people from the United States, I got to meet people that I know from the UK.

- I can't imagine another community. And for lack of a better word, I'll say community, that you can connect with people all around the world like we do and so easily. - Right. - Because you've already gotten over 90% of the hurdles that humans normally have with each other when they're first getting to know them.

Do we align on this? Do we align on that? - Right. - You could say, yep, about 90% aligned, so I'm kind of gonna let my guard down a little bit. - Yeah. - And get into these deep conversations where you can connect with people.

- Yeah. - Did I ever think that I'd have a buddy in the UK? - Mm-hmm. - Nope. Germany? Nope. South America? Nope. But I do now. - Yeah. - And it wasn't very difficult to build these relationships with people.

- No. And it's kind of, it was kind of neat being a nim 'cause you go there and you're like, okay, like, and I guess I have to introduce myself as Bing Bong, 'cause these guys don't know what I am, so.

- Do you feel silly? - Really? - A Bing Bong. - Yeah, Bing Bong, yeah. I mean, that whole name came up from a years ago from one of my friends just randomly threw it out there and then I was just like, man, I remember when I was creating my Twitter page.

- Uh-huh. - I was like, yeah, that'll work, so. - Every time I say Bing Bong in my head. - Yeah. - Christopher Walken did this movie about Ping Pong. - Yeah. - I don't always say Ping Pong.

(laughing) - In my head, right? Yeah, so I mean, just the privacy aspect of it was cool, but just getting to meet them guys, it was, yeah. So the whole nim factor, and it's kind of crazy when you think about it because it's like, okay, we look at the internet and you look at the way they're able to surveil people

and the way they're able to, like, really pinpoint and put their thumb on you through the internet process. It's the same internet that allows us to communicate with people all over and build these relationships, and it also allows us to mine Bitcoin and our garage and decentralize the system.

- Yeah. - So, you know, what is evil can also be good. - Right, so we'll turn it right back around on them. The tool that they're using to control us is also our weapon to free ourselves.

- Yeah, and I think that's the way that we have to look at it. And I think that's probably one of the things that brings the plebminers together or the plebs together is that, yeah, we're, in a way, we're fighting back.

- Mm-hmm. - With the technology that they created to try and control us, we're saying, fuck you. - And it's relatively easy. You plug in a machine, whether it be a node or a miner, and you feel like you're doing something.

That's part of that, I feel like I'm having to do something. So, I'm in the fight, just by doing this simple thing. Now, that's just the first step in the fight. You've got a lot more to go.

And so, you've done some things here at your house where you're running your node, you're mixing, you're reusing the heat from running a6, but you kind of obfuscate your mining with a VPN.

Can you talk about your VPN setup a little bit? - Yep, yeah, so that's, you know, like when you get into the whole aspect of wanting to, how do we do this privately? How do we, how do I want to do this so my internet provider doesn't know exactly what I'm doing and where I'm pointing my hash rate to?

And so, it's like, Eco once again, I mean, hats off to him, he put out the guide for the PF sense and basically I paid you back off that. I went out and got a net gate router and yeah, I basically set up that wire guard system.

So, my, basically I have four different tunnels that are all running different servers for the, whether I have it in a Virginia server or a North Carolina server. And once that, once the-- - And that's a feature of wire guard, which is the VPN.

- Yes, 'cause the problem with a VPN is the latency issues, 'cause the latency, sometimes you run a VPN, you get latency issues and if you're on your phone and you're running a VPN on it, you can't watch videos or you get a lot of lag.

So, what this system allows it to do, because you're running Bitcoin, obviously, you want to maximize the rejection rate that your miner's producing or you want to, you don't want to be, you don't want to be lagging or putting latency in the system when you're trying to put as much hash rate into that pool as you can.

So, what this does is basically if it sees latency in the one tunnel on that, it may be in Virginia on that IP address, it'll automatically switch to another one. So, your latency just basically makes it null and void.

So, yeah, and I mean, I set it up on its own system, it has its own LAN network and then I have like a working system on a different LAN network with my Bitcoin stuff and kind of my home stuff is just, I run it, I don't run that through the VPN, like the TVs and stuff like that, just because-- - 'Cause you don't care that the feds know

that you're watching SpongeBob SquarePants. - Well, at first I did and then you get, you know, you go back to the wife thing and now you get about, you know, this ain't playing that ain't playing.

So, it's just, you know, the problem about it is that they kind of got you nailed down. A lot of them providers, like even-- - Yeah, Netflix doesn't like VPNs. - As soon as they know you're trying to VPN.

- Unless you pay for the very expensive VPN and then they somehow let you in. - Right, yeah. But I mean, back to, you know, the whole thing with back to the immersion set up. So, you know, we were talking a little bit about, you know, moving that resonant heater over.

So, you know, I'm not losing anything, really. Like, eventually in my head, I want to be able to heat my home because I have a boiler system. I can, right off the bat, I know that I can use my, I can at least heat the garage.

- Yeah. - And eventually be able to hopefully heat my whole house and get rid of the gas all together. You know, and then, and that's, you know, down the road. But like you said, you made a good point about like, you know, you've only been doing this for a year and you get on, I mean, you're always, I think when we get in this space,

you're always thinking, you're always like five steps ahead. Like I want my immersion system to them yesterday. But, you know, I have all these other projects going on that me and my buddy have going on.

And we research the shit out of everything. So we make sure that we do it and we do it right. And then slowly we get to that point. And I think that's the, that's how we work as plebs. I mean, sometimes we want to go all in and we want to do everything as quick as we can.

And then mistakes get made. So what we're trying to do is not make so many mistakes and just take it slow. But like you were saying, like, you're always thinking. So now I think, okay, I have X amount of hash rate on the system and now it's like, you know, you get to this point, you're like, okay, we're in a bear market.

Man, then minor prices are looking really good. So maybe I can buy some M30 plus pluses and I can up my terra hash. You know, that's how my, that's how my brain always works. And then I find myself scrolling through Telegram and I'm looking at Kaboom racks and I'm on, on the minor.

I can't remember what the other one is, but you know, looking at minors, I'm sending Luxor ASIC trading desk. Hey, give me a quote on two of this, you know? And then thinking about how do I break this to my wife?

I want to buy two more rigs, you know? And then I'm like, well, what can I do? Maybe I can just, you know, pull two of my lower hash rate units and I'll just sit on them. And maybe if it gets crazy again and the price goes back up, I can sell it and make of, I kind of had this same feeling since the XP's came out.

Yeah, exactly, you know? Or, you know, so that's, I'm always kind of like, I'm always in that thought process and the smote of like, and I think that's how, all right. So we had to take a little break with the bathroom and you were talking about what's minors and the new what's minors and the temptation to, to get some more.

Temptation to upgrade. I mean, and I think like when you, when you're looking at that, my, my, my brain also goes to, okay, look where we're at now, like, you know, we're living in this America where inflation is an issue.

I'm pretty sure everybody in the United States has seen some kind of increase in zero percent. Yeah, zero percent. That's right. In July. In July. Well, that's what counts. Yeah, exactly.

But, you know, I'm sure everybody is seeing like, you know, our local electric provider has gone up three cents a kilowatt hour in the amount of like three or four months, which when you're only paying five cents and it goes up, you know, I mean, that's over 50%.

There's that high school education. Yeah. I mean, so, and when you're thinking of mining profitability and, you know, is, there's a, there's a line there where it's like, okay, should I just be purchasing coin or should I be mining, you know, and you have to.

So when I'm thinking about, all right, you know, everything about me wants to purchase another minor, but then, okay, I got to think about where's the electricity rates going? Like, I mean, we have at least two more years of this administration and the direction that country's going and then, you know, you think like, okay,

another administration's gonna come in, it's gonna take them and if they go in the right direction, if they go in the right direction. Yeah, exactly. They're serving the same masters. Exactly.

So, you know, we could be able to forward your cycle here like crazy electricity rates. Then I gotta bring it back and be like, okay, you know, maybe I should just let this play out and see where we're going.

I mean, you know, we're, we're, me, because of you, you know, we have a pretty good lucrative little deal with the electric provider that we're using. But it's going to expire and I'm, I'm in fear for what's gonna happen to my home setup.

And then that contract expires. They can't be dumb enough to be like, yeah, we'll renew it. They seem pretty dumb. You know what I think the issue is with that particular company that we have a contract with?

It's green energy based. So they're getting some kind of kickback. Probably. So who knows with this, we have to work the system. Yeah. We have to, just like you were saying, the internet is a tool to surveil us.

It's a tool to control us, but we are taking that weapon and turning it back around on them. And if they want to do all this green initiative stuff and green initiatives are fine as long as it's in a decentralized way and done by the parties that, you know, are involved in it.

Let's take the government out of it. Yeah, because the problem is, yeah. But we're going to get some sort of kickbacks for getting solar panels, for doing wind, for participating in the green energy revolution.

Correct. So my hope is that we can somehow find out these loopholes. Yeah. I mean, to say that I didn't look into solar, I mean, you could see where I live. Yeah. I mean, I have a section of my yard out here that I was like, yeah, I mean, I had the guy come out and it was just, for me to get an ROI

and how many panels I needed to run my house, I think I needed 36 panels and like, you know, and then where you really want to be, is you want to at least get to the point where you're selling some back to the network.

Yeah. And to me, for me to do that, the cost of that infrastructure was way more, it would have, you know, maybe if I would have done it when I was 20, I might have seen it, but you know, you know.

And your twilight years now it's like, yeah, exactly. I mean, the older you get, it's like, okay, I got to look at like, when am I going to see a benefit to this? Yeah. You know, me doing that, I wasn't, that wasn't based off of my, you know, my 200 amp service.

That was based off of what I was using, 1000 kilowatts a month and based it off of that. So if I would have went that route, I would have screwed myself out of, you know, I would have spent a lot of money on solar a couple years ago and then if I would have went down, I couldn't, the mining thing wouldn't have been lucrative for me.

So yeah, you know, so you have to put all that stuff together. I mean, it's just, I think it's scary where the inflation's going and, you know, it's crazy when you think about it, like we have to, you have all these companies and we live in a financial world where everything has to be subsidized because it really doesn't work.

You know, we need, we have to get government kickbacks because yeah, oh, well, if it's not, let's subsidize stupidity. Right, 2008. I mean, I mean, Satoshi, I mean, what, you know, everybody was thinking like, and we have like easy forgetters.

Like, I think everybody's already forgotten about what happened back then. But like, the big companies just get a bailout and in the middle of class gets, we never felt the pain enough to where the people that were responsible for 2008 never felt the pain enough to where they would correct their behavior that cost it in the first place.

Right, and you see it happening again. The proverbial kick in the can down the road. Yeah, when does the road end? I mean, look at the housing market right now. I mean, it's doing the same thing again.

Yeah, we don't feel it as much in these areas of the country, like the Sunbelt feels it. Yeah, and I've always kind of say that people will, things aren't exciting around here. You don't have Silicon Valley types coming in and driving up the property values.

Yeah. So it is kind of boring, but it's also safer. Where we're at today though, when it's more like right now, like renting, it's cheaper to own a house than it is to rent in some cases.

So I've talked to realers around here in a small town where like people are buying houses without even coming to look at them. I mean, they're doing, they're matching whatever the offer is, and it's like, I can't wrap my head around that sometimes.

It's the same as a bot that does day trading. Exactly. Yeah, and I mean, when you live in a small town, like where I'm from, it's, you know, like you said, we don't always see the effect in the rural area and that I'm thankful for.

I mean, you hear it all the time, man. I mean, like, I don't know that I'd want to live real close to a city, you know? I certainly don't. Especially when we've seen what happened, you know, two years ago, you know, the riots and everything that happened.

Yeah. You know, that wedge that gets split between us, people get, I don't know, some people get crazy. Yeah. So, for me being able to live in rural America, I kind of like it. It is a blessing.

Mm-hmm. And I don't know anything different. I mean, I was born and raised here. Yeah. I didn't move far from my parents. You can see that. Yeah. You know, they are right there. Right? Hello.

You basically see my parents' house from where we're from. (laughing) So we went into, you get some miners. Mm-hmm. You just get two, your buddy gets two. You're running them in his garage.

Yep. It's heating up like crazy. They shut down. You guys build these boxes, but you got some inspiration off Econo Alchemist. You build a box, you exhaust it outside. You say, what am I doing exhaust in this outside?

We live in a cold weather place. Let me harness some of this. Right. You tap off two six inch ducks, run them into some infinity duck fans at whatever CFM they are. Mm-hmm. And you can individually control those based on heating your, the need for heat in your basement, and the need for heat in your garage.

You have all this stuff running off of VPN, another guide from Econo Alchemist that you got, into PF Sense and using WireGuard and all this stuff, and you've partitioned your network, so you have your miners on one part of the network, and some of your other interests on another part of the network, and then you have a non-VPN part

for day-to-day family type stuff, correct? We've talked about you having the desire to get some additional what's miners, and the pull towards that, but you're probably just gonna sink your capital into an immersion system.

And can you tell me more about that? We talked about you taking your, your resonator heater there, and doing some immersion stuff with that, but tell me how you got thinking about immersion, and what steps you've taken to, to dunk.

Yeah, and just to reiterate on what you were saying, like, and for anybody that thinks that they can't do this, or they think that it's hard, like, I'm just an average person, I'm an average guy, I go to work every day.

I, you know, I have-- I say that all the time, there's nothing special about me. Right, right, but the people in this place, the plebs that we have that are willing to share their information is what keeps it going.

The whole meshed-out theory about, you know, making it so, you know, we stick together in that, we have this community, and we do, we have a community, and I don't even have to see these people to have a community.

People are willing to give me their knowledge for free, you know, free and open-- No consulting fees. I mean, yeah, and when you go down that privacy aspect of it, you know, you look at, like, free and open source software.

I mean, these are regular devs that are given their time to secure the system and not to have some third party controlling it, you know. So, yeah, but, like, back to the immersion setup type deal, it's like, I guess the immersion thing always caught my eye, like, I think, right when we first started mining,

and I was telling my buddy, maybe we should look into this, and then it was like, we started looking at the cost of the oil, and, you know, the cost of maybe a sequester, a tank, and a dry cooler, and just kind of got turned off off a bit by a little bit, you know, and it continued to progress, I guess, and I just kept an eye on it.

I've always been in the immersion technology telegram. And for me to get information a lot of times at night before-- Big shout out to Ryan Hawkins in there. It's like I was always helping people. He is, he is.

But any, like, this is, and I'll go back to being an average pleb. Like, you're an average pleb, and I need information, and then that's what I'll do, like, I'll wait till there's 100 messages in there, and I'll see the same thing.

I'll see all this guy's doing something cool, like, OK, and then, OK, there's this handle. I can DM him on Twitter. I can DM him on here. I can ask him some questions. You know, I've reached out to Jeremiah.

You know, you've pointed me in that direction and talked to him about his immersion setup. So it's a lot of-- before you actually jump in, it's a lot of, you know, I guess, or what do they call that?

Like, there's a process. Like, we have to, like, do your research. You do what I OR, yeah. Exactly. So research it. It usually starts with lurking. Right. And then reaching out to one guy, and then now you're in the click, and you get to be more free with your questions.

Exactly. And as soon as you do that, because at first, you're like, oh, man, I'm going to reach out to this person. I don't know. And then, all of a sudden, they're like, boom, boom, boom, boom.

I mean, I've reached out to Envision on Telegram. I mean, he's in the immersion tank. I mean, he's done some stuff with building his own dry coolers. And so you just ask these guys, like, hey, I'm thinking about it.

I got the same amount of miners. I want to do the same things. Tell me what you would do different. Like, I'm looking at your system. What are some mistakes you made? You know, and they-- boom, they send me pictures.

They send me information. This is what I would have done different. I would have done this. I would have done that. And then you just, over time, like a six or seven month period, you know, me and my buddy are just starting to put this stuff together.

And you start thinking, OK, then it comes down to like, OK, well, let's just-- let's draft up a tank. You know, like, what can we do? Are we going to buy a tank? Or, you know, we live in a rural area where we have metal fabricating shops.

Like, I'm sure we can just have them bend something up for us. So we sit down, we figure out where the miners need to be. You know, we draw it out, the waterfall effect. We get a design. You know, take it to the local-- Cardboard.

Cardboard is very helpful. And that's what we did. I took the Cardboard right to the three shops that we have. And I said, can you make this? Can you make this and give me a price on it? And the person that had the cheapest, you know?

Now, what are you doing again? Right. Yeah. And that's the question I got when he's making him. He's like, what are you doing with these? And, you know, I'm just like-- And I mean, it's a small town.

So you kind of-- I've known-- I know the guy that he made him from just doing work and stuff like that. I was told him I was-- and they just laugh, you know? Because they don't really understand it.

And he's like, OK, buddy, you give me money. I'll make anything you want. Right. So, you know, the tanks are done. And now we're in the process of doing dry coolers. And, you know, it's just-- like I said, it's kind of like a slow process.

And then the vision is-- or the vision is to have, you know, a heat to garage, hopefully eventually, to heat the house. And then who knows, you know? I mean, who knows what's going to happen?

You know, in the next halving, you know? That's the question you have to ask yourself. Like, when we go to-- from 6.25 to 3.15, like, where are we going to be? It's home mining is still going to be profitable.

I mean, is the price going to rise enough? Is it difficult? You're going to go too high. There's a lot of variables when you do this. So you have to really play that over in your head and try to make the best sound decision at the time that you can.

And we have to stay agile. We have to stay innovative in order to survive the next halving. Because we don't know what's going to happen. I mean, the price could go up exponentially. But the price of electricity could go up exponentially.

The price of miners are going to go up exponentially. So we have to stay on top of things. It really just can't be, despite our anxiety and desire to work and innovate. But you can't do nothing else to just plug and play.

And that's it. That's something that an institutional guy can do. And if they didn't do it right, well, let it declare bankruptcy. But for us, we've sunk our lives. A lot of our capital. This is a lot of money for guys like us, just regular dudes.

A lot of our lives, we've had these machines in our house. And I don't want to unplug them. No, I think that would just be a huge defeat for me personally if I were to unplug these machines and capitulate.

I agree. Yeah, I agree. And I think at an early age, I grew up in a family-owned business. My dad does excavating and paving. And I think at an early age, he taught me something growing up.

And when I was working with him, when you're on a job site and you're obviously what you're trying to do is make money. I can't just be focused on the project at hand. If I'm digging the ditch, I can't just be thinking about digging the ditch.

I've got to be thinking about five steps ahead, putting the pipe in the ditch. What do I need next to be able to put this together? What do I need next? Well, what do I have to be telling that person?

Because I'm the supervisor. What do they need to be doing? And you always have to be five, six, seven steps ahead of yourself. And I think that plays out-- I see that play out in the pleb minor or the pleb community because we are.

We're always evolving, we're always thinking outside the box. We're always five steps ahead of-- or trying to be five steps ahead. Like I said, we don't know what a year is going to bring, but we at least have an idea in our head.

And that's where we go with like, OK, how can I be the most efficient at this? OK, I'm going to use the heat, and I'm going to eat my home, or I'm going to heat a swimming pool or heat a hot tub or get some kind of effect out of that or be able to use that resource.

So there's more to it than just, OK, I'm mining Bitcoin. And I think that when you're a mining company, it's just all about profit. It's all about, OK, I'm just going to throw all this capital at it, I'm going to plug all these miners in, and we're just going to live off the profits, or however that works.

We are, we're a small-scale electricity rate, really. Or the mining difficulty can really throw what we're doing off, whether it gets to the point where it's easier. If you follow a condo like he got to the point where his electricity rate was too high, and he kind of had to shut off the miners, because it was just, it was easier,

it was better option to go buy Bitcoin than it was to mine it. So, yeah, I think that pleb mindset has always been, and that's something that was instilled in, and I do it at work, too. And what was the crazy part about it is that I see people that don't have it.

I work with a lot of people that need to be told every step of the way. Like, you need to do this, then you need to do this, then you need to do that. And there's no-- because my boss will always ask me, like, you know, you're a foreman that just can't run a crew, because the foreman just sits there, you know?

And it's like they just don't have-- I thought it was a set it and forget it kind of thing. Yeah. I told them what to do, and then I get to sit on my hands and collect a paycheck. Right. But you're the guy that has to be the thought guy.

You have to be thinking, like, OK, what if this happens? What do I need to be doing next? You know, and that's how you make money. I mean, that's how successful people make money. They're not just digging the ditch and digging the ditch.

They're thinking about, OK, I've got to do this next. I've got to do that next. I've got to-- you know, and that's kind of the mindset that we have. And I guess it's some point-- maybe in some point in my life, I thought, well, everybody's like that.

And then you grow into an adult, and you get out there, and you start thinking, man, there's people out there that are dumb as fuck. Like, and I guess I don't want to be mean, because I think-- I just think-- You're just making an observation.

Exactly. What I think is common sense to somebody else is, you know, I see it every day at work. It's just like, these guys just don't get it, man. Like, you have to be involved. You have to be a part of.

You have to be engaged. If you want to be a leader, them qualities have to come out. You can't be a leader by just standing there. I mean, people have to have to look at you and be like, OK, this is the guy with the answer.

We're looking at you. What are we going to do? You know, and that plays into this, too. I'm not saying that I'm a leader of anybody in the pleb community, but that thought process really provokes what happens in-- You don't have to be a leader in the pleb community.

You're leading your family, and this is the best way that you know how. Correct. You want to secure their future. You want to be a sovereign family here, and you feel that Bitcoin is the way to do that.

And that kind of plays into the heritage of this area and the shape to who you are. This is a working-class area. And to me, from what I observed, driving through your downtown, that it's a working-class area that has survived a lot of the Rust Belt downturn.

I'm not saying it's not as successful as it was in the 1950s, but you've held on. I mean, I'm all over this area, and I've just seen a lot of dilapidated communities. What do you think about your work ethic and the work ethic of this area that has kind of given you the skills and given you the drive

to be the pleb minor that you are today? Did you learn lessons from working with your dad, doing excavating, that kind of manual labor thing that makes you a better minor? Yeah, I think that that all plays into who I am today.

That whole work ethic. I don't think you can just give somebody that. That had to come from-- That's earned through blood sweat and tears. Being 12, 13 years old, hey, we have equipment that needs grease.

We have trucks that need wash. That was me and my brother's job on the weekends. And then growing up, and then you start learning how to grease the trucks or change a brick can or work on the engine.

And all that stuff is just like, I never went to school. It was just kind of like taught. You did go to school. Yeah, hard knocks. Yeah, I mean, just learn. A lot of people go to school to learn these trades, and I was fortunate enough to just be grow up around it and understand this is what it takes to be successful.

So I think that plays into it, and it plays into the whole pleb aspect of it, for sure. I mean, you were talking about this town. I mean, this town has built on a lot of manufacturing. And you were just talking about electricity prices.

When you look at us as pleb miners, you look at somebody that's doing manufacturing, whether it's powdered metals huge around here, carbons big. So there's a lot of factories. And you get into that-- this area has a lot of that seven to three aspect of it, seven to three, three to 11.

There's three shifts. The shift work. Shift work. It's very prevalent in this area, because all the plants run on shift work, they're 24/7. They're not shutting down. So you kind of get into that mindset.

And then the thing to do around here, when you're not working, is drink beer. And that's just kind of our community. It's kind of-- Not to do anything wrong with that. No, not at all. I mean, people, they feel they work hard.

They want to play hard. I think people say what's ruining the country or what's ruining kids today. And I just think back, this was my backyard when I grew up. And we didn't sit in my house.

And I mean, I grew up playing outside, riding on four wheelers. This was my landscape. It's just going out and being creative, building the fort in the woods, climbing trees, figuring out how to do that.

Like, I look at my-- even my son and my son is adopted. And it's just like, it's crazy to think about these kids today. It's like, I feel like they don't have what we had. And I don't know if it's the cell phones or the computers that have made that different.

Yeah. Sometimes I feel there's only so much you can do as a parent to be like, get out of this house right now. And then the kids go out of the house, and they turn around and look at you for these puppy doll guys, can we please come back in the house?

So it takes that active participation to get out there with them and make them do that. But that's fine. I guess that's the burden that we have to bear in modern society. But it's not difficult for guys like us.

We obviously want to actively participate in things. So you being that kind of guy, like, actively participating in mining, how do you think mining can keep a community like this going? How does that active participation?

Once people start to understand Bitcoin, they're going to want to start to understand privacy. They'll take these common paths, because every conversation that you have at the pleb starts the same way.

I got in because I wanted fiat gains. I started looking at the technology aspect of Bitcoin. Therefore, I got into privacy, or I wanted to DCA every day, or I wanted to get my coins off of exchanges, so I learned about wallets and privacy and stuff like that.

Then you have people that go a little bit step further and want to get into mining. So I feel like there is going to be a lot of labor-type guys when hyper-Bitcoinization happens, and people start to really understand about it.

And the niche for guys like us is mining. So how can you see guys out here who are on a swing shift, who want to come home and drink some beer, play around with their muscle car, and possibly play around with the miner?

How can that kind of improve and keep communities going into this? We're at a point where even in this rural area, there's mines that are popping up. We live in an area where fracking for marshall is really big.

And to anybody listening who's anti-fracking, and I know you guys are out there, you don't understand the benefit that it has brought to this area. And how dead this area would be without fracking.

It has given new hope to farmers who could not make a profit off of their land. And now they can come and buy new tractors. And we could talk about regenerative agriculture and why stoking the land with nitrogen is not a good thing in using tractors.

But it's given everybody a new life. That's already to interrupt you. But I just wanted to make that point of how important fracking is, and cheap energy is to areas like this. Right, and on a side note, like you said, we talked about it earlier.

When we were in this area, you get to that point where it was like, when fracking was going to become big, they were like, they're going to ruin the water. They're going to ruin the wildlife.

There was a ton of fun. And a lot of fun. And you see it all the time. And then here we are 10, 15 years later, and they're still doing it. You mean there's not flames coming out of your tab?

No. How about that? Right. Who knew? Yeah. You see all these videos where people were doing that. And it was like-- Yes, yeah. It is crazy, man. I mean, people are afraid of change. And I see it at work.

I see it in this community. I see it just everywhere. But I think like, where do we go? So right now, like I said, we have some mines popping up. There's one down the road here where somebody's using an actual powder metal factory that went out of business.

Obviously, voila, there's a substation right there. So that person garnished a bunch of miners, and they're using that. And then there's some people that are actually-- they're using their flare gas, or they're using their gas well to be able to mine, and they're running generators.

And in the one local town, I mean, it's getting a very bad rap. I mean, there's articles coming out. This lady keeps writing these articles about how the-- and I've never been over to this area where the-- I'm assuming it's the generator that's causing the noise.

Excuse me. Not so much the miner. But they're claiming that the 24/7 noise is-- we were doing harm to their chickens. They won't lay eggs. The animals are being weird. And it's just like, when somebody gets that, and you get this right up in the paper, and then they start putting noise ordinance on these.

And you hear about how they're-- I mean, I've even read an article in the One Township. They wrote this article about how it was going to-- the Bitcoin mining. They use the water underground to cool the mine.

And it's going to inject all these bad things into the water. And I'm just like, there's so much fun. So how is one person in a small community where there's only a handful of us doing this?

How do we make it so it's not this fun? Because the fun is overwhelming sometimes. And all you have to do is tell somebody about Bitcoin, and they're like, oh, yeah, they bring up an article of fun.

Or this is bad. Or it uses too much electricity, or this or that. So I think-- and then you talk about that. Where's that fine line of like, OK, I want to be private, because I don't want everybody knowing what I'm doing.

But on the other hand, there's a trade-off there. Where's the trade-off in my community where if somebody needs help, I'm obviously going to reach out. But at this point, I don't think me shouting from the rooftop downtown in my local town is going to do me any good.

I think the adoption has to come, or not maybe the adoption. But more people have to be aware of it. And then we live in a small town. There are people that know what I'm doing. There are people that know what my buddy are doing.

It's not-- so I mean, people know, I think, if they get into this space, they know, hey, contact Bing. Yeah. Or Bong, or Bong. So maybe the two of you are Bing and Bong. Mr. Bong. Mr. Bong.

Mr. Bong. You said that you don't necessarily consider yourself a leader, but I think that you are. I mean, you're obviously leading the pack here in town as far as the home mining goes. And with a bunch of laborers, swing shift laborers, people that work in a carbon factory, or a powdered metal factory, this is an interesting town

because they started off just doing lumber. I believe German immigrants doing lumber, and then a railroad comes into town, and then you get a little bit of coal, and you start to do these different things in metalwork, that these are people that want to touch and feel something.

You're not going to have a deep conversation with them about UTXOs, but you can talk about electricity. You can talk about HVAC stuff. You can talk about the trades with them. And it's something that I said in the plebminor proclamation is you really pick up on a lot of the trades.

So you are a leader in that way, because you have something here at your house where you can say, "Hey, come on in my garage, "and let's have a couple beers, "and I can explain this to you."

Go to a town council meeting. "Hey, whoever wants to go and actually see Bitcoin mining, "I can show you that right now." And I can show you what a benefit it is to my home, where I don't have to have resistance heaters, doing absolutely nothing, where I don't have to burn natural gas.

You guys have a lot of fun about natural gas. Guess what? Now I just got rid of that natural gas heater that was in my basement. Yeah. Electricity is apparently much greener than combustible.

That's what they say. Yeah. So let's, of course, build a bunch of batteries. But now, guess what? I don't need batteries. My battery is the Bitcoin network. So you are a leader. You are doing the things necessary, and it will come to fruition.

You'll go to a town council meeting or you'll be at the bar or riding bikes to the mountains with somebody that doesn't understand it. And you say, "Hey, come on over to my house. "Let's look, let's touch, let's smell, "let's feel the heat come out of these things."

And then that'll be a segue to deeper conversations. Right. I think the biggest thing where I struggle now is when somebody does ask, like, there's so much knowledge that you can't just, I can't.

I just feel like I vomited all out at once. I want osmosis to work. Can we mind meld real quick? And I want you to know everything that I've researched in the last year and a half and here, you just have it.

Because I remember what it was like when I first, you know, when I first got into the space and people were talking about hardware wallets and people were talking about whirlpool and I'm just like, "Fuck."

Dude, I'm telling, I mean, you want to talk about, you want to talk about like, shitting razor blades. Like, you buy your first miter. I don't want to talk about shitting razor blades. You buy your first miter and you're using coins, you're sending thousands of dollars over the internet and you're just like, "Oh my God, I want this one."

Yes. You know, line farm buy a scammer. I'm like, line farm buy. Hey, I just sent the transaction, did you get it? Did you get it? Did you get it now? Yeah. And, you know, I mean, in the early days, I did some stuff that I probably, you know, when you hear about people send a little bit, you know, trying this out.

Yeah. The mistakes have been made on my part. I never lost anything, but it's like cheap mistakes are the best. Yes. Yeah, shitting razor blades is like, "Oh man." And now it's like, I think back to that and it's like, now that I know the network, now that I know how transactions work, now that I even know like, even in the samurai ethos

of like how a coin join works or how, you know, being able to do that with a partner and being able to, you know, hide the, what they can see on chain or not hide it, but just make it harder for a chain analysis to be able to track that.

Not the low hanging fruit. Yeah. I mean, when you first get into that, you just don't, you understand, okay, I'm being private, but you don't really maybe know how the back end works. And it takes a little bit to understand all that.

And the only way that you understand that is people like Brother Rabbit, people like the Ronan Dojo team, people like Samurai Wallet that sit in these telegram groups. And anytime you have a question, they answer them or they put out information and video as Bitcoin Q&A, like his whole webpage, like just scrolling through that,

it's just a plethora of information. So I think when, you know, instead of me, I think I got to get to the point of, instead of me trying to explain all that stuff, maybe here's a resource, go to this resource, you let them absorb it at their own rate, you know, me trying to just babble on for 20, 30 minutes

because it's something I'm passionate about. And when I get passionate about something, I try to explain it and I feel like, I know what I'm talking about, but they probably have, 'cause they go, I just don't get it.

- Yeah. - I just don't get it. - But you've put in your work, you know, throughout this conversation, we're giving lots of nods to Q&A and Brother Rabbit and Diverter and Colonel Alchemist, but in your way, you're a leader.

You're doing stuff for people. You're already doing stuff for your community, whether they know it or not. It will come to fruition soon in the future. - Yeah, yeah, for sure. - At Bing Bong, I really appreciate you having me at your home.

- Yeah. - I appreciate this conversation. - Yeah. - I appreciate learning from you and looking at your setup there in your house. And I appreciate now, I can call you my friend. - Awesome.

Yeah, I can't wait for September and this all stuff, this stuff to drop and hats off to Max and everything that he's doing to help us put this together. - Yeah. - I think it's gonna go in a good direction and hopefully it continues and can be an annual thing or I'm hoping so.

- And I'm curious. I mean, I can't wait to see what Barn Miner gets into and, you know, Zuck this and me and you, we're all kind of doing our own thing and not doing our own thing. We're doing our own thing, but we're in the same space.

So, you know-- - It's a powerful group of pleb miners. - Yeah, it's exciting. It's exciting to see what they do and what we're doing and all come together. - Yeah, and there's a little bit of competition in there too.

So that's kind of fun. - Competition's always good. - All right, brother. Thanks. - Yep. - Thanks for listening. I really hope you enjoyed that. Don't forget to enter for a chance to win these incredible prizes.

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